Excellent, good to know.

How much input do you guys as first aiders have in resus guidelines and which route do you take to impart your experiences. I'm not being flippant here - genuine question. Because the cardiac consultants need to know what works and what doesn't from the ground up.

Thanks Kev. I am pretty familiar with the guidelines but as you say they aren't always written for the lone rescuer and people do ask a few 'what if' questions. Your interpretation is the same as mine. It's just good to bounce ideas off other people sometimes and this forum is great for that. Perhaps I am guilty of the diversion from Vinnie so unless anyone out there has something different to add, I'll say thanks to those who replied to my question and draw a line under it.


Back to Vinnie. I taught the topic in a school today and used the Vinnie video. It is generally liked by the children and they had picked up on the compressions but if there is one thing they needed reminding of, strangely, it was the need to call 999.

I still like it though.



Peter

Whilst its easy to say ..."send for the defib" where I work I'm the only FA left on site during the late afternoons. Yes I carry a radio, but I am just thinking about 1. having to describe the deifb. 2. how to open the cabinet & 3. where its located, to a say a cleaner who only works in a certain area. There isnt many "knowledgable" staff around at certain times - and this include school holiday where we can still have a few dozen people (staff / contractors) on site.



So, where do you locate a defib, we've go a huge building complex full of inquistive kids during the day! Do you leave the patient and get the defib yourself which can be several minutes away and then back. Or stay with patient?



I agree perhaps the Cardiac Specialists need to take on board what happens on the ground with First Aiders, before ambos turn up.



Maybe soon defibs will become very cheap with some oxygen readily available in some instant-to-use packs. 

Send one of the kids to help, get others involved in CPR some simple instruction like push down hard as you can about 120 times a min

Thanks for the welcome :)



Not sure if it is a national policy, but looking at the 2010 Guidelines again this is what I found under Pre-Hospital Cardiac Arrest: http://www.resus.org.uk/pages/prehosca.pdf (under Defibrillation Vs CPR )



There is the argument about keeping compressions going to maintain perfusion, which I think is the idea behind our local policy.



Cardiac Arrest calls are the highest priority in my service, and if the dispatcher can't get a vehicle to back-up an RRV in a timely manner they will often dispatch another RRV to assist, and it has been known for them to ask the Police to attend to give assistance, so it normally isn't long before the defib can be attached.



The part about AEDs is interesting as well: http://www.resus.org.uk/pages/aed.pdf as it states minimal disruption to good quality CPR - it is a decision you will have to make; do you cease good quality CPR to attach the AED or wait for help to arrive?



In my experience it can take quite a few seconds to turn on the machine, open the pads and apply them in the correct fashion and then check the machine for shock / no shock, and I am an experience practitioner; you need to figure in uncertainty on the part of the lay responder when using an AED...



As with most things if you can justify your actions... :)

I agree with Deek, I am also a RRV paramedic and first on scene at arrests, usually when I arrive at an arrest there is someone who has called the ambulance in the first place. Depending on who and how they are they can be instructed to assist but failing that basic life support only is done and cpr is continued until back up arrives.

With regards to the vinnie thing, does he actually say he needs a victim who is not breathing or does this advert take into account normal breathing which is what trainers teach. (maybe this would complicate the simple message they are trying to get over.

the BHF compressions only campaign is really good, however not everyone wears a sovereign round their neck, and also there should have been a note on the ad, "adults only" whereas drowned adults, and paediatrics whole different ball game.

LOL, sorry but I still will not be kneeling in the middle of the local high street pounding on some one's chest whilst singing my head off.