You Are Here:: Forum
Login
Minimise


Register
Forgot Password ?

Latest Blogs
Minimise
Marmite's Last Stand
My Secret Vice
When is an advantage not an advantage?
Welcome Guest! To enable all features please try to register or login.

Notification

Icon
Error

2 Pages<12
As stated by another member
daveolley Offline
#21 Posted : 30 July 2012 13:58:00(UTC)
daveolley


Rank: Member

Groups: Registered, Registered Users, Subscribers
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 35
Points: 105
Location: UK

MPH

Out of interest I copied this from the JRCALC Clinical Practice Guide.



Complications of spinal board use

The concern of placing patients on a board for long periods is centred around pressure area problems. In Pre-hospital context this does not present a practical problem but care to remove debris from under the patient, and keys and other sharp objects in the patient's pockets should be taken.



Are you saying that placing someone on their back is less of a problem regarding pressure areas than placing them on their side?
PrivAmb Offline
#23 Posted : 30 July 2012 21:27:57(UTC)
PrivAmb


Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered Users, Subscribers
Joined: 27/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 203
Points: 612

By my reckoning Dave, you and your broken neck should, by law, on pain of having houses repossessed and going to jail and being sued for 10 million pounds, should have been turned no less than 8 times with a 9th turn being planned. You should make your feelings known to the CQC, HPC, NMC, GMC, PCT, and the fearsome multi tentacled beast that is OFQUAL - because when they get annoyed, they will scream and scream and scream until they turn blue and collapse and then people will take notice..................

Apparently OFQUAL went on Dragon's Den a couple of years ago. Theo Paphitis was heard to say "So, you want me to give you £100k, and I will get absolutely nothing in return, and people will be able to earn more money than me by not paying you any? I'm out"!
mph Offline
#22 Posted : 30 July 2012 22:00:29(UTC)
mph


Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered Users, Subscribers
Joined: 27/05/2011(UTC)
Posts: 660
Points: 1,980

Originally Posted by: daveolley Go to Quoted Post
MPH

Out of interest I copied this from the JRCALC Clinical Practice Guide.



Complications of spinal board use

The concern of placing patients on a board for long periods is centred around pressure area problems. In Pre-hospital context this does not present a practical problem but care to remove debris from under the patient, and keys and other sharp objects in the patient's pockets should be taken.



Are you saying that placing someone on their back is less of a problem regarding pressure areas than placing them on their side?





an interestingly selective quote there Dave,



in the introduction to the section of neck and back  trauma in JRCALC it states that people should spend no longer than 45 minutes on an unpadded long extrication board , based on a Cochrane review. 



in the section on  transporting patients with a suspected spinal injury it suggests if the patient  will be immobilised for more than 30 minutes that a vacuum mattress should be used .



the simple fact is that placing anyone  immobile on a hard surface and then preventing them from moving and pressure relieving - whether by immobility or by  restraint  presents problems with  the microcirculation - especially if there is already impaired circulation by virtue of shock or neurological issues both in terms of local vascular  tone in the microcirculation and in the general vasculature . However you position someone who is unconscious and/or unable to pressure relieve you will create pressure po where  bones  are not overlaid by a thick layer of muscle and/or fat  and create a localised pressure point  to the skin between the bone and the hard surface. 



In terms of should this be taught on first aid courses for the public  i'd suggest that  in general perhaps not but as with anything  there are factors where you  do have to consider this e.g. outdoor activities or  those who work in remote areas where  response times may be prolonged  -  and remote is in terms of time to help not necessarily distance to the road - some industrial settings may qualify  as 'remote' due the  difficult access  even if you can get rescuers and their vehicles  close to the injury site ...
daveolley Offline
#24 Posted : 31 July 2012 09:49:54(UTC)
daveolley


Rank: Member

Groups: Registered, Registered Users, Subscribers
Joined: 16/11/2011(UTC)
Posts: 35
Points: 105
Location: UK

Originally Posted by: PrivAmb Go to Quoted Post
By my reckoning Dave, you and your broken neck should, by law, on pain of having houses repossessed and going to jail and being sued for 10 million pounds, should have been turned no less than 8 times with a 9th turn being planned. You should make your feelings known to the CQC, HPC, NMC, GMC, PCT, and the fearsome multi tentacled beast that is OFQUAL - because when they get annoyed, they will scream and scream and scream until they turn blue and collapse and then people will take notice..................



Apparently OFQUAL went on Dragon's Den a couple of years ago. Theo Paphitis was heard to say "So, you want me to give you £100k, and I will get absolutely nothing in return, and people will be able to earn more money than me by not paying you any? I'm out"!





To be honest had anyone suggested turning me they would have been told where to go.

When you are laying on your back with the strangest of sensations in your legs and an intense burning pain down both arms you need very little persuasion to stay still
TLC Offline
#25 Posted : 09 August 2012 17:14:45(UTC)
TLC


Rank: Advanced Member

Groups: Registered Users, Subscribers
Joined: 11/07/2011(UTC)
Posts: 147
Points: 474

Cheers to all who have contributed to this thread, I feel that some good points have been raised and yes you are 100% that a unconscious patient should go into the recovery position, all first aid books state this.


Sometimes it might be not be possible to do this however, eg Patient stuck in a confined space or it is not safe to do, I guess that is when other airway techniques come in handy if you have the knowledge and training.


I was thinking if a first aider would be with a patient for more than 30 minutes and it is possible in remote places, mountain climbers, caves and extreme sports, or even maybe during bad weather flooding or major incidents, fishermen out at sea the list goes on.


With cut backs in the NHS you will begin to see longer waiting times for 999 response and might end up staying longer with your patients.


 


 


 


   

Users browsing this topic
2 Pages<12
Forum Jump  
You cannot post new topics in this forum.
You cannot reply to topics in this forum.
You cannot delete your posts in this forum.
You cannot edit your posts in this forum.
You cannot create polls in this forum.
You cannot vote in polls in this forum.

Powered by YAF | YAF © 2003-2011, Yet Another Forum.NET
This page was generated in 0.102 seconds.
Home  |  Link Exchange  |  Forum  |  Directories  |  First Aid Blog  |  Events  |  Links / Downloads